Today we begin our 2 day discussion of Pride & Prejudice, the 1995 version by BBC – the most beloved period drama of all time. There is a legion of fans who love it and who bring it up whenever one mentions period dramas or simply the book. Jane Austen became even more famous after Colin Firth made millions of women around the world swoon with his interpretation of Mr Darcy! The series follows the book pretty closely and maintains that atmosphere of restrained feelings and unmentioned passions that are so attractive to our contemporary society that is used to a totally different set of rules when it comes to amorous pursuits.
The interpretation is flawless, the costumes just perfect, the set absolutely wonderful and the landscape is breathtaking. We feel with Lizzy her indignation for what she believes is Darcy’s despicable behavior, we laugh with her father’s ironic comments, we despair of ever having a coherent thought out of Mrs Bennett or Lydia and feel dearly Jane’s disappointment. Through 6 episodes we go through a whirlwind of emotions as we follow the contempt, the understanding and finally the attraction that Lizzy develops for Mr Darcy. As we reach the end we are as anxious as he is for her feelings to be revealed…
Feel free to share your love (or addiction!) of P&P, your favorite characters or moments, the scenes you hate the most, what you would change if you could, is this version too old compared to the new movie with Keira Knightley… But maybe you didn’t dislike anything, if you’re like us it’s perfect as it is!!
As we mentioned before, it’s a 2 day discussion (of course you can continue to comment if you like and we’ll do the same) and today we’ll start with the first 3 episodes so don’t forget to come back tomorrow for the 3 last ones.
To celebrate our discussion about this wonderful story we will be giving a copy of Pride & Prejudice by Jane Austen (Penguin Popular Classics) to a visitor who leaves a comment on the discussion threads until January 15th midnight (GMT +0 : Western Europe Standard Time ). We’ll announce the winner the next day (16th January).
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Mrs. Bennet is desperately looking for a husband to each of her five daughters. When Bingley and Darcy arrive in the town, the two gentlemen have very different reactions to the girls and the local society. Considering some of Mrs Bennet attitudes was Mr Darcy right in his arrogant assessment of society? Do you think Lizzy was attracted to him the beginning? Was he only attracted to her because she reacted differently to him than all the other girls?
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Mr Collins character is introduced and we are made aware of how precarious the Bennet’s sisters’ situation is if something happens to their father. Accepting Mr Collins marriage offer seemed to be the perfect solution for Elizabeth to help her family but she couldn’t help herself to do such sacrifice. We’ve always wondered why Mr Collins didn’t propose to Mary next. They would have been perfect for each other. |
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Lizzy meets Wickham whom she finds an interesting young man. At the same time her opinion of Mr Darcy becomes the worst possible as she believes him responsible of her new friend’s hardships. Jane is disappointed in Bingley and Lizzy soon finds out Darcy had a hand in that. Finally, Mr Darcy cannot resist his attraction for Miss Bennett any longer and he proposes… to Lizzy’s shock! First of all, what do you think of his proposal? And should she have answered differently ?
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Screencaps by Angela (Seriously Smiling)
I watched the series last week to get ready for this discussion and, the same as last time, I loved it! And I mean, really loved it.
Yes, I did like North and South, and Richard Armitage is really really interesting. But nothing beats P&P and Colin Firth´s Mr. Darcy. Nothing can.
First of all, let me say that I read the book before watching the series a couple of years ago. I loved te book from the start, and since it was my first Jane Austen, it was a wonderful introduction to this Universe. Having enjoyed the book so much, there was a certain dread as to what the series might bring, especially since most movie/tv-show adaptation lack the real flavour of the story. But in the end it turned out to be a great adaptation – the characters were there, the situations were there, the animosity turn understanding turn admiration turn love that we all ell in love with in the book is there. And Colin Firth was there, but that was just na extra
My favorite character was naturally Lizzie. She is the focus of the story, the one through which we see and understand the characters. Maybe that´s the reason why Mr. Darcy seems extraordinarily arrogant in the beginning – more than his personality, it was also the way Lizzie saw him after that first encounter. That´s why I grew to love him at the same time Lizzie came to know him better. But if the main characters were great, I have to admit to adoring Lydia. I´m a big fan of Julia Sawalha since Press Gang, and she is just perfect as the annoying young Lydia.
I´m curious to see what everyone thinks of other versions of this story – the old BBC series and the most recent movie. I´ve never had the chance to watch the 1980 series, but I didn´t like the movie with Keira Knightley.
Now, on to the episodes:
Episode 1
Mr. Darcy was just too arrogant for his own sake – yes, the Bennets weren´t the most proper people in the room, but to express his feelings out loud like he did was also a bad judgment call.
I hadn´t thought about the origins of the attraction, but you certainly make a good point.
Episode 2
The Dance, that wonderful dance. Again, Lizzies personality is hilarous, the way she bickers and prods him constantly, trying to get a reaction out of him. And the way Mr. Darcy looks at her shows that his feelings have already changed.
The cousin was also a great comic relief.
Episode 3
Mr. Darcy´s proposal was really akward, and I understand why anyone would have refused him based on his motives, but Whickham´s story and Darcy´s hand in Jane unhappiness only made the situation worse. Still, not matter how I love the character, no matter how interesting Colin Firth is – a proposal should never be a burden. Lizzie was right to refuse him. But more important than that is realising that the reason she was so distressed in the end, after he left, is because she felt something more for him than a mere animosity.
Ah, the plot thickens. Another suitor shows his face as Mr. Darcy´s feelings can no longer be contained.
Like most people, I also thought this series was exceedingly well done. I’ve been really looking forward to this discussion.
Darcy may well have been correct in his assessment of the society he found himself in, but he was rather rude. Having said that, I think he found himself a bit out of his depth. By his own admission later on, he does find it difficult to mix with new people, and these new people were quite different from the people with whom he usually associated.
I think he was genuinely attracted to Lizzie almost from the beginning. Certainly, he acknowledges his interest in her to himself quite early on in the book (chapter 6?). My inclination is to think that Lizzie wasn’t initially attracted to Darcy.
I love the Mr Collins character, I think he’s funny. Also, he does give Mr Bennet a good opportunity to practice his sarcasm and wit. I think that by Mr Collins proposing to Charlotte and being accepted, it illustrates to the reader how things really were. The Bennet sisters may dream, but Charlotte’s practical and pragmatic character reveals the desperate situation that many young women found themselves in – having to marry men regardless of attraction or emotion. I think the situation of Charlotte marrying Mr Collins makes Lizzie’s later refusal of Darcy’s proposal all the more dramatic.
I thought Darcy’s proposal started out well, but then he started mucking it up! You can’t really blame him for assuming that, of course, she would accept him, so I thought he took the refusal rather well! Given her feelings for him at the time, I think she was right to refuse him. (Having said that, if it was real life, and I had been her friend in real life, I would have told Lizzie to get over it, to face facts, and to accept him. Then I would have asked her if he had any brothers!!!).
Finally, I wish that Darcy had smiled more in the series. In the book, Lizzie is described as a playful sort of person, and Darcy does find her amusing and smiles a bit around her. In the series, I don’t think we get this aspect of them very well.
great insight on Mr. Collins and Charlotte´s relationship. I sometimes forget to see past the main characters and relationships and look at the series as a whole. But I agree with what you said.
Oh, and girls – can you edit my comment? I seem to have mucked up one link. Depressa e bem, não é verdade…
Ohhhhh, I want a laptop with DVD player! No matter that I watched the series about eight times in two weeks *cough* during Christmas. The Hollywood version of P&P was the first one I have ever seen, but frankly, I can’t even remember who plays Mr Darcy. I mean to watch it again, if only to compare and gloat over the BBC version LOL. I wouldn’t say that the 1995 version is too old-fashioned. As opposed to earlier adaptions, this one tried to be as true to the era and culture as possible. No impossible eye make up (as in the 70s) or backcombed/teased coiffure that renders many former adaptions quite ridiculous. I was wondering if the BBC are planning a new adaption of the book one day, if they dare to, and, as history shows they already did a few times. I strongly believe that the Ehle/Firth P&P adaption will always be the one all others are going to be compared to, no matter if it is stamped “made in Hollywood” or not.
I also read the book first when I was a teenager and then one day, while watching some TV, I saw the beginning of a historical serie and stopped to see what it was. Well, no need to say it was love at first sight! This version of Pride & Prejudice with Colin First and Jennifer Ehle continues to be one of those I watch several times a year. Even if Lizzie and Darcy are my favorite characters, I do think they are all perfect for their roles. Even now, I really have troubles imagining someone else playing Mr Bennett and Donald Sutherland didn’t convinced me at all in the P&P movie, neither did the new Mrs Bennett or even Mr Collins who created some of the most amusing scenes in the book.
The 1980 version is more interesting than the new one, imo. The acting is more stiff and it looks more like a play than a serie but it’s quite funny to watch another kind of Darcy. In the other hand, I didn’t like at all the 40’s adaptation by Hollywood. For some minutes, I thought I was watching Little Women or Going With The Wind…
Syrin,
I also adore Julia Sawalha! She’s such a good actress and I actually saw her for the first time in The Press Gang. Do you know she’s part of Cranford’s cast? Her character is lovely!
Oh and which line do you need to be edit?
About the P&P movie, I didn’t like it at all. The only thing I really find good in this version is the music. Mr. Darcy is not Jane Austen’s Mr Darcy, Lizzie is not at all as I pictured her (where the wit and the humor?!), the same about her family and Mr Collins (where’s the ridicule?!) and what was done to Mr and Mrs Hurst?! The 19th century social rules were mostly ignored (same for the wardrobe!) and they portrayted the Bennett family as if they were poor and destitute. This really was a free adaptation and had nothing of what I most like in Austen’s world.
Julia Sawalha is fantastic. I read that she is considered to be the small screen Kate Winslet. She doesn’t want to be pressed into any stereotypes and is courageous enough to take on unpleasing and challenging roles.
Didn’t know she was in a new series, but T has already promised to lend me some more great period dramas.
Don’t worry about the line – somone edited it almost as soon as I posted the comment.
I have to admit that I hardly remember the film version – I watched it once, after reading the book and watching this great series, and just couln’t get into it – the feel isn’t there, the characters aren’t there. Where’s the Pride? Where’s the Prejudice that made us fall in love with the characters?
Right now I can’t really see another adaptation, but in the future, maybe. But only if they keep Colin Firth.
I find all your comments really interesting!
Dee, I think you are right about Charlotte Lucas and I even think the Bennett girls know that, they just don’t have the courage (or enough despair yet) to do it and accept something less than true love.
Oh and I also really like Julia Sawalha which I’ve seen in Absolutely Fabulous
At this point I feel that I should confess…I’m not a Colin Firth fan! I think that he did Mr Darcy well (and I’m definitely a Mr Darcy fan!) but I haven’t been that taken with him in other roles.
I liked the latest movie, simply because I’d like any film that’s based on P&P, but it’s not something I’d watch many times over. I did think that Mathew McFadden was a nice looking Darcy and he had that brooding thing going on – but I don’t think he ’sparked’ with Knightly.
I finally have some free time to comment!
I agree with you, girls! Darcy was extremely rude with the locals and even if he is not at ease with unkown people, he was extremely arrogant and displeasing. Between him and Mrs Bennett, they almost draw some blood!
We see right away he cannot take his eyes of Lizzy, he is constantly watching her and even when he insults her (“She is tolerable; but not handsome enough to tempt me; and I am in no humour at present to give consequence to young ladies who are slighted by other men.” *ouch*), he seems fascinated by her. We see this attraction grow very quickly but Darcy rarely shows his feelings.
Oh and the dance is perfect! It’s so obvious they are meant to each other.
Dee,
it’s true that Charlotte pragmatic decision always makes me think more carefully about womens condition in the 19th century. She knows that being a spinster without her own house and means to support herself, she would be a burden to her family. The only logical way seems marriage to someone who could support her in an acceptable way and Mrs Collins seems to be a good option. Lizzy’s refusal of Mr Darcy is not only dramatic but for instants I do forget her personal situation and I think I understood a few more things now that I saw Cranford where most of the ladies have a certain age and are single or widows. However, I still think Mary would be his perfect match!
LOL!! In RL we would all force Lizzy to jump and cry “Yes, yes!” even before Mr Darcy had the chance to propose!
He might be arrogant but I felt he was unsure of her feelings and certain that she would accept him because of his situation. Badly done, Darcy! What a poor choice of words… No wonder, she got extremely mad!
Absolutely! We needed more smiles! The new Sense & Sensibility has the same problem. The serie is good but it seriously lacks the usual with and good humor we are used to see in Austen’s books (and which were present in Emma Thompson’s version!).
Now, that is interesting, Syrin! If there was another Pride & Prejudice version, who would play Mr Darcy? Any suggestions?
Yep, yep, yep! Couldn’t agree more (again!) Dee! There’s no sparks between Mcfayden and Knightley but maybe the fact that Colin Firth and Jennifer Ehle were having an affair when they were filming P&P made things easier for them
Now Alex, would you recommend the new S&S BBC adaption or not? I have been ogling for quite some time now, but I first wanted to have a look what the critics say.
I just posted my opinion about it in our last post about the serie, Kat.
Go have a peek!
I just skimmed through episode 1 last night and I remember something that bugs me. In the book, it says that when Bingley first came to meet with Mr Bennet (in other words, when we first met him) he was riding a black horse. In the series, he’s on a white horse and Darcy is on a black horse. Now, I know this is an utterly stupid thing to be bothered by, but why couldn’t they just swap horses? That way it’s one more little detail that was so easily kept accurate.
It’s a bit like at the end of North and South when Margaret told Mr Thornton about the money she had in the bank, and it was a different amount from in the book!
Funny thing, I was thinking about Bingley’s and Darcy’s horses some days ago because I read the same passage.
Like you say, it is a tiny detail but it keept me wondering also. Why should Bingley have a white horse and Darcy the black one? Were the colors meant to be related to their characters or is it just coincidence?
Well, since N&S end was a bit “free” maybe they also thought the amoung of money wouldn’t be important either.
That’s just silly IMO to change tiny details like that. What’s the point? Also wondered the same thing about N&S
Can anyone tell me, how the news of an alarming nature, came to Lady Catherine De Bourg. Who told her, when Lizzie didn’t even know.
Maybe Colonel Fitzwilliam suggested to Lady Catherine that Darcy was enamored of Lizzie?
[...] well but really can anything be more appropriate to convert new viewers than Mr Thornton or Mr Darcy?? We think not and those are usually the most lended DVDs of our [...]
Hi, Pride & Prejudice is my favorite film!!! I can see it again and again……I saw it twise on russian language is my native!!!! so Thank You and Good Luck!
There are reasons to believe that Jane Austen was a black or coloured woman, of European stock, like Elizabeth Barrett Browning and her husband Robert Browning were, according to Julia Marcus (1995).
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/is_n7_v50/ai_16878140/
That’s probably why we live with this idea that there should only be one, amateur portrait of this famous author in existence. My guess is that the black portraits are kept in hiding, or were destroyed.
I do love Pride and Prejudice enormously and like to compare the four TV and cinema versions I know off. The latest with Kiera Knightly, in the role of Elizabeth Bennet, gives a shortened version, but augments the role of Mrs. Bennet a lot. She does not come off as silly anymore, but purposeful and successful. The best Mr. Bingley ever! I like the imposing entrance of the nobles at the ball, which gives a better perspective on the boldness of Elizabeth Bennet in trifling with such a powerful and dangerous man as Mr. Darcy.
Miss Knighly never strikes me as a intellectual type, as I saw her horsing around in some action pics. So she does not convince as a scholarly Lizzy. But she’s young while all the other Eliza Bennets seem old and stately. With all versions there is always some fooling around with the status of the Bennets, like if the women really work in the house or if they order their staff around for every trifle. The viewer would sympathise with them a great deal more if they actually worked around the house. Sometimes the housekeeper Hill is a man, other times he is a women. Sometimes the domestics are privy to all family conversations, other times not.
Most interesting are the realistic dark, decors, with distressed walls, weathered and lived in. Less conspicuous empire costumes then usual. The clothes don’t call too much attention to themselves, and are sometimes quite dreary. Kiera is defiantly flat chested, so we move into realism where Miss Austin does not write realism. But I’m not fond of the elder ladies wearing ancient regime, eighteen century robes à là Française or à la Anglais. Did the British really kept these styles, while even in the eighteen century they were more relaxed then the French.
Perhaps the next version should show the Bennets as blacks?
Blue blood is black blood (1500-1789): http://forum.politics.be/showthread.php?p=4294443